Regrets on the wheels and tires I bought?

[tJKrider]

I treated a guy who was shot in the head point blank with a .45. Bullet never penetrated the skull. But I don't recommend getting shot, either.
Sometimes you just get lucky. Doesn't change the facts.

That just says the user of the .45 wasn't very good at what they did.

Same can be said with the users of spacers. It's not a fault of the spacer, assuming a quality product. Your suspension won't know the difference if the tire and resulting load are in the same location. You do have to be diligent with the maintenance and treat it like the separate, fastened component that it is, however, and I'd wager that is the cause of spacer-related failures. It's not luck, it's physics and mechanics of materials...

No debate that an appropriate rim to achieve the same goal is the better way to proceed.

 

[Ratbikerod]

I treated a guy who was shot in the head point blank with a .45. Bullet never penetrated the skull. But I don't recommend getting shot, either.
Sometimes you just get lucky. Doesn't change the facts.

Much like many touted bulled penetration statistics that are stated as fact, while I agree that a 45 to the head is never recommended. Guns, reloading and shooting are another major hobby.

The idea of spacers (good ones, properly made and properly fitted) should cause no additional stress to the suspension components than an overly wide tire. In fact, tire weight and size are most likely the primary factor to failure. So whether that 37 is on a wide positive offset rim or bolted to a spacer should make little difference. We put huge, heavy tires and articulate the suspension to the max and blame the spacer when something fails.

Now, all that said, I am going to be doing light offroading mostly for camping and mountain biking. So I doubt that I will come close to ever stressing spacers or anything else on my Rubie. Does not mean I won't, I have been caught with my pants down before, and even in my more advanced maturity and age, I suspect it will happen again. I may not be as good as I once was, but I am good once as I ever was....

I swapped back to the stock Rubie wheels yesterday and spacers are at the house to be put on today after work. I can say right off the bat that I much prefer the look of the stock setup. Those wheels I got are just too darn wide and made the tire bow out too much. I should have checked that more. They might have worked better on a 35 or 37, but I have no plans to go that big....at this point....

I will post pics when I get it all sorted.

The interesting thing about the front sag is that it is also (I am noticing) really based (visually) on where I park it. If I back it in my drive the front looks a lot lower. If I pull in forward it is almost level. Optics are a funny things.

 

[Anybodyhome]

On this point "your JKU looks like the stance has a rake back to front", I do feel like mine has more than I notice in others. Not sure if this is just a byproduct of spring sag at 75,000 miles or something that was initially inherent.

The shocks are really rusted and pitted and in bad need of replacement. If I do a 2.5 leveling lift, should I opt for one with new springs? I would assume yes, but I do not want to create a really harsh ride. It would be fine for me, but the wife will complain. I was thinking of a 1.5-2" with Fox Pro 2.0 shocks. But maybe something else is in order.

You don't need new springs. The Rubi comes off the assembly line with better springs than the Sport and Sahara. I don't have a Rubi, but I've been told the springs are a touch taller and stronger.
Just remember that any lift more than 2.5" will require new adjustable control arms, drive shaft, etc. due to the geometry change.

 

[tJKrider]

I don't have a Rubi, but I've been told the springs are a touch taller and stronger.

Correct. I should've taken a picture of the original Sahara front springs next to the Rubicon springs I just installed but didn't. The free state of the Rubi spring is taller and there is not as much compression due to the increase in spring rate once installed. The OP should be good with springs. I also added a 1" front spacer to adjust for the rake on mine...

 

[BigAL07]

Much like many touted bulled penetration statistics that are stated as fact, while I agree that a 45 to the head is never recommended. Guns, reloading and shooting are another major hobby.

The idea of spacers (good ones, properly made and properly fitted) should causew no additional stress to the suspension components than an overly wide tire. In fact, tire weight and size are most likely the primary factor to failure. So whether that 37 is on a wide positive offset rim or bolted to a spacer should make little difference. We put huge, heavy tires and articulate the suspension to the max and blame the spacer when something fails.

Now, all that said, I am going to be doing light offroading mostly for camping and mountain biking. So I doubt that I will come close to ever stressing spacers or anything else on my Rubie. Does not mean I won't, I have been caught with my pants down before, and even in my more advanced maturity and age, I suspect it will happen again. I may not be as good as I once was, but I am good once as I ever was....

I swapped back to the stock Rubie wheels yesterday and spacers are at the house to be put on today after work. I can say right off the bat that I much prefer the look of the stock setup. Those wheels I got are just too darn wide and made the tire bow out too much. I should have checked that more. They might have worked better on a 35 or 37, but I have no plans to go that big....at this point....

I will post pics when I get it all sorted.

The interesting thing about the front sag is that it is also (I am noticing) really based (visually) on where I park it. If I back it in my drive the front looks a lot lower. If I pull in forward it is almost level. Optics are a funny things.

Well said young man

 

[tJKrider]

Correct. I should've taken a picture of the original Sahara front springs next to the Rubicon springs I just installed but didn't. The free state of the Rubi spring is taller and there is not as much compression due to the increase in spring rate once installed. The OP should be good with springs. I also added a 1" front spacer to adjust for the rake on mine...

Here is a before/after visual...

 

[Anybodyhome]

So, let me ask this hypothetical question..... could I find a set of Rubi springs and install them without having to make any other changes to my suspension? I have a 2.5" lift and when I put new shocks on I ordered the proper length for the lift.

 

[tJKrider]

So, let me ask this hypothetical question..... could I find a set of Rubi springs and install them without having to make any other changes to my suspension? I have a 2.5" lift and when I put new shocks on I ordered the proper length for the lift.

Other more informed members may have a better assessment of this but I'll give you my opinion.

I haven't seen anything while looking at "small" lifts (2.5" or lower) that call out the trim level - Sahara, Sport, Rubicon or offer different components depending on which you have. Not to say that they don't exist, I just didn't see them. Even the AEV 2.5 doesn't discriminate... So what is the baseline to achieve the 2.5"?

Note: Spacer lifts are a bit more explicit, but when you are replacing springs all bets are off... It would be helpful if the spring kits stated a reference, resulting dimension on the chassis/frame on an otherwise stock vehicle to take the guesswork out.

I assume you added spacer lift with non-Rubi springs and now want to add Rubi springs. I would think that would be fine, in my opinion. I would check with the shock mfg, however. Seems as though they are good for a certain range, not just one explicit lift - Bilstein, for instance. You can expect to get around 1" from the Rubi springs (depending on what you have now) so as long as that keeps you within the travel range you're good.

You can also pose the question to the lift mfg. If you had started with a Rubicon, instead of a Sahara, is the resulting geometry still ok with their components?

My guess is they will say it is...

Open to "you are totally wrong" from the experts, though. Just my logic based on my own research.

 

[Ratbikerod]

I have been going back and forth on the above question and theroycrafting. I had read that the Rubi springs are a bit of a lift but are also progressive. Thus, I was considering just doing a light lift with spacers as the springs are doing a good job and the ride on my Rubie is pretty nice. Also, the wife can get in without any issues, which is a benefit.

I am now considering just doing a fender trim and seeing if I like the look and function just as well as I would a lift. Granted, it would not provide any more suspension travel, but for my needs of camping and MTB’ing it should be more than adequate.

However, I want to leave the door open for a small lift later. My stock shocks are really badly rusted and pitted. I want Fox Pro 2.0’s that are supposed to be made in a 0-2” lift version. But I am balking at the $199 per shock price point.

 

[Ratbikerod]

And who changed my thread title!? I liked my misspelling of Regrets, that was on purpose!

 

[tJKrider]

I have been going back and forth on the above question and theroycrafting. I had read that the Rubi springs are a bit of a lift but are also progressive. Thus, I was considering just doing a light lift with spacers as the springs are doing a good job and the ride on my Rubie is pretty nice. Also, the wife can get in without any issues, which is a benefit.

I am now considering just doing a fender trim and seeing if I like the look and function just as well as I would a lift. Granted, it would not provide any more suspension travel, but for my needs of camping and MTB’ing it should be more than adequate.

However, I want to leave the door open for a small lift later. My stock shocks are really badly rusted and pitted. I want Fox Pro 2.0’s that are supposed to be made in a 0-2” lift version. But I am balking at the $199 per shock price point.

Can you post a pic of your Rubi on somewhat level ground?

 

[Ratbikerod]

Can you post a pic of your Rubi on somewhat level ground?

Here it is, back to the stock wheels and wit 1.5 spacers.

 

[Anybodyhome]

Other more informed members may have a better assessment of this but I'll give you my opinion.

I haven't seen anything while looking at "small" lifts (2.5" or lower) that call out the trim level - Sahara, Sport, Rubicon or offer different components depending on which you have. Not to say that they don't exist, I just didn't see them. Even the AEV 2.5 doesn't discriminate... So what is the baseline to achieve the 2.5"?

Note: Spacer lifts are a bit more explicit, but when you are replacing springs all bets are off... It would be helpful if the spring kits stated a reference, resulting dimension on the chassis/frame on an otherwise stock vehicle to take the guesswork out.

I assume you added spacer lift with non-Rubi springs and now want to add Rubi springs. I would think that would be fine, in my opinion. I would check with the shock mfg, however. Seems as though they are good for a certain range, not just one explicit lift - Bilstein, for instance. You can expect to get around 1" from the Rubi springs (depending on what you have now) so as long as that keeps you within the travel range you're good.

You can also pose the question to the lift mfg. If you had started with a Rubicon, instead of a Sahara, is the resulting geometry still ok with their components?

My guess is they will say it is...

Open to "you are totally wrong" from the experts, though. Just my logic based on my own research.

The reason I posed the question is this: my 2.5" lift has an actual lift of 2" after I've added after-market steel bumpers each weighing it at 80lbs+. Shocks are less than 6 years old and were purchased to match the lift height. Theoretically, if I were to replace my springs with a set of Rubi springs, I would likely get at least the 1/2" of lift back and not have to worry about squatting if I threw 20 bags of concrete mix in the back.

I did find this in another forum:
"The 59/60 Rubicon front springs are useless and soft as heck, I had that combo (plastic bumper). Once I put on aftermarket bumper and winch, the front end sagged a whole 1 INCH.

Now the 61/62 (steel bumper Rubicon) can definitely give you some moderate lift, better yet if you can find or 63/64 (diesel Rubicon), you may even get rid of factory rake. Problem is not a lot of aftermarket diesel lift for now, so we haven't seen these stock springs."
What he is referring to are the different springs used on the Rubi, depending on year/options.

Sahara springs part #’s
Front Driver - 68253658AC
Front Passenger - 68253659AC
Rear Driver - 68253589AA
Rear Passenger - 68253590AA

Rubicon spring part #’s (just one number up on each):
Front Driver - 68253659AC
Front Passenger - 68253660AC
Rear Driver - 68253590AA
Rear Passenger - 68253591AA

 

[tJKrider]

The reason I posed the question is this: my 2.5" lift has an actual lift of 2" after I've added after-market steel bumpers each weighing it at 80lbs+. Shocks are less than 6 years old and were purchased to match the lift height. Theoretically, if I were to replace my springs with a set of Rubi springs, I would likely get at least the 1/2" of lift back and not have to worry about squatting if I threw 20 bags of concrete mix in the back.

I did find this in another forum:
"The 59/60 Rubicon front springs are useless and soft as heck, I had that combo (plastic bumper). Once I put on aftermarket bumper and winch, the front end sagged a whole 1 INCH.

Now the 61/62 (steel bumper Rubicon) can definitely give you some moderate lift, better yet if you can find or 63/64 (diesel Rubicon), you may even get rid of factory rake. Problem is not a lot of aftermarket diesel lift for now, so we haven't seen these stock springs."
What he is referring to are the different springs used on the Rubi, depending on year/options.

Sahara springs part #’s
Front Driver - 68253658AC
Front Passenger - 68253659AC
Rear Driver - 68253589AA
Rear Passenger - 68253590AA

Rubicon spring part #’s (just one number up on each):
Front Driver - 68253659AC
Front Passenger - 68253660AC
Rear Driver - 68253590AA
Rear Passenger - 68253591AA

Are those JK part numbers?

My 2016 Sahara part numbers were:
Front: 52126314AA
Rear: 68004256AA

Replaced with 2016 Rubicon:
Front: 52126318AC
Rear: 68004460AA

The last two numerical digits in each being of key significance...

 

[Anybodyhome]

Are those JK part numbers?

My 2016 Sahara part numbers were:
Front: 52126314AA
Rear: 68004256AA

Replaced with 2016 Rubicon:
Front: 52126318AC
Rear: 68004460AA

The last two numerical digits in each being of key significance...

No, the example I posted are JL part numbers, but it was to show the difference between the various springs available based on Rubi model. Again, as you stated, the last 2 numbers being the most important as they depict the spring rate, or compression.

 

[tJKrider]

No, the example I posted are JL part numbers, but it was to show the difference between the various springs available based on Rubi model. Again, as you stated, the last 2 numbers being the most important as they depict the spring rate, or compression.

Got it! I had read that each numerical increase in the part number is roughly equivalent to 1/4" of lift all things being equal... That seemed to hold true for me: 60-56 = 4 * 1/4" = 1". I got a little more (1/4" or so) but went from springs with 76k to ones with 7k so I think age also factored in.