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Jeep Wrangler JK Resources
JK Resources
Jeep Wrangler JK Suspension Performance Diagnostic Guide
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<blockquote data-quote="Mr. Bi-Polar" data-source="post: 431087"><p>I wanted to push this topic back up to the top of the forum. main reason is that We've had to deal with the death wobble on 2 other jeeps and now we're seeing signs of the shimmy or wobble developing on our current jeep. As I've stated in my build thread, we developed a serious issue with the drag link, tie rod and I suspect the track bar.</p><p></p><p>The issue is and anyone can check this themselves, id the ball joints. Although other factors may cause or accentuate the ball joint issue, which I'll list below. I've seen images and videos of jeepers crawling under their jeeps and twisting the drag link and/or tie rod. The rods themselves would move forward and back at different rates depending on the amount of wear to the joint. This is not normal and don't let anyone tell you that it is. The jeep will start to sway or drift on the highway.</p><p></p><p>If the rod on the drag link, tie rod can move forward and back, chances are it can also move from side to side, which will cause the drifting issues. Let alone if the ball joint is worn out at the pitman arm which can also cause a drifting issue. </p><p></p><p>[MEDIA=youtube]yuhvAIVSBao[/MEDIA]</p><p></p><p>Take note that the tie rod does moves with some resistance, but the drag link move extremely easy. If you're steering moves like this forward and back, chances are these components will also move from side to side causeing drifting issues.</p><p></p><p>The factory ball joint comprised of a metal ball joint with a socket housing and a nylon shim or bushing. These are prone to wear out prematurely. An upgrade ball joint Like the Moog products have a metal ball joint with a metal housing and zero bushings. These types of ball joints use grease as their bushings. But if the housing does not have a sealed rubber boot, the grease will splurt out leaving an exposed ball joint to the elements.</p><p></p><p>I'm no expert at this, but Have suffered with an extreme case of death wobble while accelerating up hill at 60 mph only to have the death wobble to occur nearly sending us into the retaining wall. One could mask the shimmy or drifting with a steering damper, but this would not be a legitimate long term fix.</p><p></p><p>Other issue which can accentuate the shimmy or wobble include but not limited to:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Unbalance wheels</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Lug centric wheels</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Worn shocks</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tires with a bad molded section or hop</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Control arms with worn bushings</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Ball joints (all of them)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wheel barrings</li> </ul><p>The list can and will grow over time, but it's unclear as to the main factor that would cause a full head on death wobble, other than driving over a pot hole that sends the wheel/tires into an oblong rotation. One thing I wanted to add within the list deals with the control arms. 14mm bolts installed from the factory are placed into 9/16 holes.. There will some debate as to if one should even have this corrected. As a personal preference I removed the 14mm bolts and replaced them with the grade 8 9/16 bolts. Doing this tightens up the bushing connections on the control arms. But if the bushings within the control arms are already failing, You'll still have some amount of play (forward and back, side to side) in the bushing area.</p><p></p><p>I'll go into more detail about the lug centric wheels. The Hub centric wheels will mount up to the main hub or be centered on the hub. Where as the lug centric wheels tent to move around mounting only to you lugs. The lugs could be slightly off which can create a bad rotation. Once both wheels line up with this bad osculation, this could cause the wobble to occur.</p><p></p><p>One key issue jeepers need to consider before buying new wheels and tires. Is to up grade the ball joints. If this is not done, the life span of the stock, factory or slight upgrade will be reduced significantly. So when you start think about getting new wheels and tires, best include upgrade ball joints because both of these will go hand in hand and you can't have one without the other.</p><p></p><p>Something else I wanted to way. Even after having our alignment check 6 times, those shops found nothing wrong with out setup and claim our alignment is spot on. But clearly if you can twist or rotate the drag link rod and/or the tie rod, Your ball joints have lost their rigidity and need to be replaced.</p><p></p><p>I've wanted to write this for some time, because I thought the Moog drag link, tie rod would withstand the test of time. Little did I know these components were only designed as a small/slight upgrade when one uses the factory wheels and tires. if you'e going retain your factory size wheels and tires, the moog upgrade will be an acceptable addition.</p><p></p><p>Other wise and because we've been running 17x8.5 with 34'' tires, this set up has stressed our system and it's time to make a major improvement. Although I'm not saying you should make an upgrade to 1 ton ball joints, To us it will only benefit our driving habits in the future knowing these areas have been improved and can be rebuilt if necessary.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Mr. Bi-Polar, post: 431087"] I wanted to push this topic back up to the top of the forum. main reason is that We've had to deal with the death wobble on 2 other jeeps and now we're seeing signs of the shimmy or wobble developing on our current jeep. As I've stated in my build thread, we developed a serious issue with the drag link, tie rod and I suspect the track bar. The issue is and anyone can check this themselves, id the ball joints. Although other factors may cause or accentuate the ball joint issue, which I'll list below. I've seen images and videos of jeepers crawling under their jeeps and twisting the drag link and/or tie rod. The rods themselves would move forward and back at different rates depending on the amount of wear to the joint. This is not normal and don't let anyone tell you that it is. The jeep will start to sway or drift on the highway. If the rod on the drag link, tie rod can move forward and back, chances are it can also move from side to side, which will cause the drifting issues. Let alone if the ball joint is worn out at the pitman arm which can also cause a drifting issue. [MEDIA=youtube]yuhvAIVSBao[/MEDIA] Take note that the tie rod does moves with some resistance, but the drag link move extremely easy. If you're steering moves like this forward and back, chances are these components will also move from side to side causeing drifting issues. The factory ball joint comprised of a metal ball joint with a socket housing and a nylon shim or bushing. These are prone to wear out prematurely. An upgrade ball joint Like the Moog products have a metal ball joint with a metal housing and zero bushings. These types of ball joints use grease as their bushings. But if the housing does not have a sealed rubber boot, the grease will splurt out leaving an exposed ball joint to the elements. I'm no expert at this, but Have suffered with an extreme case of death wobble while accelerating up hill at 60 mph only to have the death wobble to occur nearly sending us into the retaining wall. One could mask the shimmy or drifting with a steering damper, but this would not be a legitimate long term fix. Other issue which can accentuate the shimmy or wobble include but not limited to: [LIST] [*]Unbalance wheels [*]Lug centric wheels [*]Worn shocks [*]Tires with a bad molded section or hop [*]Control arms with worn bushings [*]Ball joints (all of them) [*]Wheel barrings [/LIST] The list can and will grow over time, but it's unclear as to the main factor that would cause a full head on death wobble, other than driving over a pot hole that sends the wheel/tires into an oblong rotation. One thing I wanted to add within the list deals with the control arms. 14mm bolts installed from the factory are placed into 9/16 holes.. There will some debate as to if one should even have this corrected. As a personal preference I removed the 14mm bolts and replaced them with the grade 8 9/16 bolts. Doing this tightens up the bushing connections on the control arms. But if the bushings within the control arms are already failing, You'll still have some amount of play (forward and back, side to side) in the bushing area. I'll go into more detail about the lug centric wheels. The Hub centric wheels will mount up to the main hub or be centered on the hub. Where as the lug centric wheels tent to move around mounting only to you lugs. The lugs could be slightly off which can create a bad rotation. Once both wheels line up with this bad osculation, this could cause the wobble to occur. One key issue jeepers need to consider before buying new wheels and tires. Is to up grade the ball joints. If this is not done, the life span of the stock, factory or slight upgrade will be reduced significantly. So when you start think about getting new wheels and tires, best include upgrade ball joints because both of these will go hand in hand and you can't have one without the other. Something else I wanted to way. Even after having our alignment check 6 times, those shops found nothing wrong with out setup and claim our alignment is spot on. But clearly if you can twist or rotate the drag link rod and/or the tie rod, Your ball joints have lost their rigidity and need to be replaced. I've wanted to write this for some time, because I thought the Moog drag link, tie rod would withstand the test of time. Little did I know these components were only designed as a small/slight upgrade when one uses the factory wheels and tires. if you'e going retain your factory size wheels and tires, the moog upgrade will be an acceptable addition. Other wise and because we've been running 17x8.5 with 34'' tires, this set up has stressed our system and it's time to make a major improvement. Although I'm not saying you should make an upgrade to 1 ton ball joints, To us it will only benefit our driving habits in the future knowing these areas have been improved and can be rebuilt if necessary. [/QUOTE]
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Jeep Wrangler JK Resources
JK Resources
Jeep Wrangler JK Suspension Performance Diagnostic Guide
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